[linderpat]

I will throw my body in front of the sawzall if Rick makes an attempt to cut the hole

On a more serious note, the job does look like a PIA, even with the motor out. I found some good threads though, and it seems like loosening the master cylnder at the firewall from inside is the way to go. Tips gents (and ladies)?

[worf]

… and it seems like loosening the master cylnder at the firewall from inside is the way to go. Tips gents (and ladies)?

The bolts go into the CMC from the interior. It’s the CMC’s flange that is threaded. There is literally no other way to unbolt the CMC.

It’s like writing “Eating, by putting food in your mouth, is the way to go.” Yes, I completely agree. 100%



The job is a 9/10ths PITA. The only way to make it truly easy as a one-man show is to have the engine, HVAC air box, and steering column in one of the other work bays far away from the subject 928. (Left to the imagination is the mental picture of the other pile of parts that need to be removed to get those parts out.)

That written, with two people it isn’t really that bad. One person needs to hold the CMC in position from the firewall side. Then one person can get the CMC bolts, bushings, cover plated threaded and started.

It is essential to have the blue hose on the CMC when the CMC is fitted. If the engine is in, it is essential to have the hard line fitting threaded but loose.

Like all jobs that aren’t easy enough for a stoned monkey to complete, the unfamiliarity of doing it the first time can be so stressful that reason can threaten flight.

Most “928 Technicians” never did the same job twice. So, every job suffered from reason flown.

[Mrmerlin]

A trick I learned in the shop was to take a piece of wire with a nut tied to its end and thread it through one ear of the CMC ,
then thread the wire through the corresponding hole in the chassis pull the wire till the CMC is pulled into position the thread in the opposite bolt and make it snug remove the wire the nut should help it fall down, then install the other bolt.
NOTE use a Phillips screwdriver the align the other hole
NOTE the first bolt should be snug to hold the CMC in position.
NOTE from your picture dont use a clamp on either end of the new silicone line,
the friction of the hose to the fitting is sufficient to hold it in place, adding a clamp can distort and possibly crack the plastic of the tank barb or the inlet pipe on the CMC.
NOTE make sure to properly trim the CMC piston tip to 75MM and add the slot to the tip,
then cut of 2 winds of the spring so it wont go into coil bind and crack.
One other thing the GB flex line is available in a longer length so it goes from the CMC outlet to the slave this will make installation a snap as it removed the hard line from the CMC.
I hope you put one of these lines on as it also makes bleeding about the easiest thing you could do to the car.

[WyattsRide]

Here's an update on my progress.

Despite the advice to replace the Clutch slave blue hose, I decided not to change it. It looks in good shape. No leaks and never had a problem with it. It may come back to haunt me. But, c'est la vie.

The engine is back in the car. The clutch is back in and the engine is bolted to the upper bell housing. With Ed R's help last night we got that clutch in. I tried myself most of last weekend after I got the bell housing bolted to the engine. But, I just couldn't do it. With Ed's help under the car guiding the short shaft into the bearing , while I held up the clutch pack, we got it in! A couple hick ups along the way. But, at the end of the night it was in and the clamping sleeve bolted on.

I wasn't drunk yet. It just looks that way!




March 9th - 11th, Joel and Mike B are coming out to Pittsburgh to lend me (and Ed) a hand getting things together. There's still a lot to do and really look forward to having their expertise. The Buckeye Land Shark group are awesome!

In the meantime I'll be putting the top end together, buying Food, booze and cigars, for their arrival. Ed will have to provide the hookers and blow.

More to follow.

[Gary Knox]

HOORAY. Great job Rick and Ed.

[SeanR]

Love it. Glad it's progressing. Congrats man.

[Bertrand Daoust]

Congrats brother.
I knew you would get it done, one way or another. :)

[worf]

Here's an update on my progress.
...
The engine is back in the car.

Excellent news.

I recommend putting spark plugs in last after you have:
- done a fuel leak check
- built initial oil pressure with the starter with LH and EZF unplugged.

In the meantime I'll be putting the top end together, buying Food, booze and cigars, for their arrival. Ed will have to provide the hookers and blow.

It is always best to drink and smoke AFTER wrenching. Getting the lawyer to "procure" is also usually best.

[linderpat]

It has been quite the experience thus far, that's for sure. Rick is fantastic at being organized and detailed, and getting this car put back together!

[WyattsRide]

Thanks all for the great comments, advice and encouragement. But, it's not done yet.

Had a hell of a time this weekend with getting the Dip Stick Tube screwed in. Should the nut/bolt turn independent of the tube? If not, it should!
Because of the bend in the tube, when trying to screw it in, it interfered with the Belt Tensioner and the center belt cover. Took the belt covers off to see if that would give me room. It did not. The only thing I could think of is straighten the tube. So I heated it up and slowly bent it more straight. That did the trick. But, with the tube in place I then couldn't get the center belt cover back on! Had to loosen the tube back up just enough to have room to fit the cover back on over the Tensioner.


Next is trying to get the Clutch Arm onto the ball. Am I having trouble because I'm out of assembly sequence or something? It seems like it should just pop on with crow bar of something. Just not getting it. The clutch is bolted on the flywheel. The flex plate relief has not been undone. The wedges are still in the 3 T bolts.
Dave, Stan, Sean or ?, advice on this?

[SeanR]

From below, move the arm in to position and use a pry bar on it to pop it in to place. You look like you are really close to where it needs to be so it should be easy.

[WyattsRide]

From below, move the arm in to position and use a pry bar on it to pop it in to place. You look like you are really close to where it needs to be so it should be easy.

Yes, it's very close to the right position. Is the pry bar used at the top of the arm (my picture) or at the bottom of the arm? I was trying at the top but couldn't get a good leverage point.

[SeanR]

From underneath. Pry on the pressure plate pulling the arm rearward.

[worf]

What Stan wrote.

From underneath you use a pry bar to move the top of the arm into position then as a lever on the bottom of the arm to pop the cup onto the ball.

*BUT*

before you do that grease the cup and ball with the special Porsche high-pressure grease that you used on the throw out bearing washers and shaft splines.

The dip stick tube is supposed to be bent, it does suck getting it threaded and turned in. It is what it is.

[WyattsRide]

From underneath. Pry on the pressure plate pulling the arm rearward.

What Stan wrote.

From underneath you use a pry bar to move the top of the arm into position then as a lever on the bottom of the arm to pop the cup onto the ball.

*BUT*

before you do that grease the cup and ball with the special Porsche high-pressure grease that you used on the throw out bearing washers and shaft splines.

The dip stick tube is supposed to be bent, it does suck getting it threaded and turned in. It is what it is.

Great guys! Thanks. I do have that high-pressure grease that I used on the splines (very sparingly with a toothbrush) and used some on the ball. I will put some in the cup also. I'll report back.

[Mrmerlin]

UMM thats not how I do this job.
My suggestion to put the release arm bushing on
First get the new bushing open up the inner edge with a dremel drum sanding tip,
not much but it makes sliding it onto the ball easier.
then drop the bushing into very hot water for a few mins.
Put a small dab of DC111 inside the new bushing,
and press it onto the ball ,
NOTE using the spline grease could speed up the decay of the new bushing,
the silicone will keep the bushing flexible.
Then use a long prybar and 2 X 4 from the top.
Once the bushing slides on then lift the release arm onto the bushing,
this can be done from top or bottom depends on how much freeplay the release arm has.
NOTE trying to force the busing onto the ball while its installed in the release arm,
could possible result in the ball snapping off.
I have seen that a few times.

BTW the dipstick tube should be straight,
That way it will screw into the girdle after you put the center cover on.
NOTE you can strip out the threads in the block if its bent
The nut portion is welded to the shaft.

To fix it put the nut part in a vice then gently bend the tube straight, heating works but you may damage the plating
NOTE dont try to bend the tube straight while its being installed in the block as you can shear the threads out of the girdle.
Bending the tube while its installed would work without causing damage

[worf]

BTW the dipstick tube should be straight,

Interesting. Every single one I’ve ever seen has been bent

I guess they get bent by some means unfathomable by me.

Not sarcasm: I believe you when you say they should be straight. You’ve touched more of that style tube than have I.

Ball cup: maybe that’s why the factory originals fail early. ‘cause factory used the spline grease. The silicone lube is a better idea.

[Mrmerlin]

for the dipstick tube they are usually bent after installation ,
so the dipstick can be pulled out without hitting the top rad hose.

from the ones I have taken apart,
its about half are bent and the other half are close to straight.
either way the S4 design is better. and I would guess that cutting threads into the girdle would save on machining cost

[SeanR]

Every dipstick I've pulled out was bent at an angle, every single one. Not that hard to remove or reinstall but I can see where some would find it difficult.

The problem with doing the ball Stans way on the double disk clutches is the lack of arm for/aft movement because the pressure plate is flush all the way around the edge where the arm sits. On the singles you have offset areas which give the arm move room to move to clear the ball. With the early ones if you put the bush on the ball and then try to manoeuvre the arm in to position you are most likely going to scrape the back side of the bush and tear it up. Boiling water, dremeling sounds like adding additional steps not needed that only cost the customer more money and you more time that could be spent doing other things.

[WyattsRide]

Just for posterity.

When the clutch is in place and bolted to the flywheel the arm can be put into position over the ball very easily and does move forward and aft a fair amount. As Sean and Dave suggested, I pried the arm at the bottom, pushing the "ball end" with bushing over the ball very easily. No drama.

I did use the spline grease on the ball and in the bushing. If that makes the bushing deteriorate more quickly, like in 20 years. Well, that will be someone else's problem then!!

In PET the dip stick tube is shown pretty straight. I suspect that the tube should be straight and that over the years it gets bent by Gorilla Mechanics. After a little bending, it still is not perfectly straight. But, it is much better than is was and I was able to screw it in without stripping the threads.

I'm bringing in some 928 mechanics from Ohio to help Ed and I get this closer to being finished. They are arriving in Pittsburgh Thursday afternoon. Can't wait!!

[JBRob007]

Hmmm…. Wonder who those guys could be…? Looking forward to helping you finish this and enjoying some Italian meatballs & pasta! “ Pay it Forward “ is our club motto and besides this what friends do

[WyattsRide]

Hmmm…. Wonder who those guys could be…? Looking forward to helping you finish this and enjoying some Italian meatballs & pasta! “ Pay it Forward “ is our club motto and besides this what friends do

You guys are the best!!

[WyattsRide]

What a weekend!

Joel and Mike arrived at my house around 12:00 on Thursday. Ed came over around 6:30 after work. Before dinner we had so much done, I couldn't believe it!


Finished up for the day. Just having some drinks and cigars! Top end tomorrow!



Back in the garage on Friday about 8:00.




By 3:30 or so, we had the fluids in and ready for the first start up!!

After that we buttoned things up more (Air box, Air tubes and fan shrouds). Put the hood on and time for another start.

Thanks so much to Joel and Mike for coming out to help get this done so quickly and efficiently. You guys are awesome!

Thanks to Ed for all his help over the past almost 2 years and for housing our Ohio friends for a couple days!

Thanks to all my on line advisers like Dave, Sean, Stan, Roger and Seth. All your expertise and advice was invaluable. I'm very sorry if I missed Thanking anyone. If you helped me any way. Even with encouragement, I Thank you!

This was an incredible journey. Probably not one I would want to do again. But, I've learned so much, that I feel I COULD do it again if I had to.

I'll see you all with my car this year at Carlisle, Rendezvous 928 and Frenzy!!

Not an ending to this thread though. I'm sure things will still come up that I'll need help with!!

[SeanR]

Great job guys. I knew you could do it man. All through your doubts and sleepless nights thinking about how daunting a task it was, look at where you are now. Congrats.

[linderpat]

Great job guys. I knew you could do it man. All through your doubts and sleepless nights thinking about how daunting a task it was, look at where you are now. Congrats.

You guys who do this for a living earn every penny you charge, and then some!

[WyattsRide]

Great job guys. I knew you could do it man. All through your doubts and sleepless nights thinking about how daunting a task it was, look at where you are now. Congrats.

You guys who do this for a living earn every penny you charge, and then some!

That's very true!

And Sean, there were a LOT of sleepless nights for sure!

[worf]

What a weekend!

…

I'll see you all with my car this year at Carlisle, Rendezvous 928 and Frenzy!!

Excellent outcome!

[Bertrand Daoust]

I knew from the beginning that you would get through this one way or another brother.
With your passion for the 928, for your beautiful car, it could not be any other way.
Ed, Joel, Mike, Sean, Dave, Stan, Seth and everybody else that helped one way or another bringing back Rick's car back to life, you guys ROCK!

SO happy to hear it again!
Can't wait for next Summer now to hear it for real!!!

[The Fat Man]

Well Done Rick!!!
Many kudos to Ed for being right there with him.
And the Ohio Crew for getting him across the finish line!

[Mrmerlin]

Wow your support crew rocks !
Im glad you all were able to put this huge puzzle back together.
When you all work together things turn out better.

Congrats Rick Im glad you can hear YOUR car running again,
it sounds good on the videos,
I would suggest to drive it easy for the first 500 miles.
Check the dipstick oil dripped onto a black piece of cardboard and viewed in the sun,
looking for metallic s you might see some as the parts find their harmony.

[WyattsRide]

And so it begins.

Took the car out for a drive yesterday. Only about 10 miles. Ran good no issues.

Today I figured since it's even nicer out, I would give the car a little more of a test. Didn't go 1 mile and the Belt Tens. light cam on.

Got the Kempf tool from Ed. So it looks like I'm going back in!!

(Because I originally had the Porken Tensioner on the car the wire for the OEM tensioner warning light plug was cut off to be grounded. I had to repair and solder/splice that little plug onto the wire again. Maybe a bad connection?)

[worf]

Maybe a bad connection?)

Possibly. But, assume nothing.

Get in there and check the belt tension. Make sure everything’s good. Then chase ‘lectrical.

[Bertrand Daoust]

It could be a bad connection.
But how tight did you adjust the belt?
In the middle of the window or higher?

[worf]

It could be a bad connection.
But how tight did you adjust the belt?
In the middle of the window or higher?

This -^

And, tension has to be set TDC Cylinder #1. If you set it at TDC #6, belt light will come on instantly (well, after the timeout period…)

[WyattsRide]

Ok. Thanks guys.

Before we put the right TB cover on, we checked the tightness and it showed in the middle range on the tool.

I will check again this weekend. I have the cover off now. But I don't have the engine at TDC yet.

Should the belt be at the tighter side of the window on the tool?

[Bertrand Daoust]

I can't say for your particular model ('86.5 - as it's a 32v, should be the same?), but when I did mine last Spring I set it higher.
I read that it needed to be on the higher side for the S4 model.
I set it at about 70%.
No problem since.
BTW, I did it twice because it was leaking a bit.
Always easier the second time... :)
Keep up the good work.

[SeanR]

Put it to the top edge of the tension window. In the middle will be too loose.

[Mrmerlin]

Note when installing the tensioner,
I would suggest to preload and hold the roller as if the belt were already installed, then tighten the bolts.

NOTE the purpose of this is to head off the loosening of the belt tension ,
because since the tensioner isnt pinned to the block, it can move unlike the water pump for example, once the block gets hot .

NOTE the tensioner is gonna slide into the bolts, if you use the Hondabond on the gasket that will increase the sliding factor .
This is a normal event as the tensioner is finding its working home.
Now you can retension your belt and the tension should stay constant.

NOTE this event happens to me from time to time since i rebuild so many of the tensioners.
usually within the first 3 heat cycles.

As stated above by Sean for the 32V the Kempf tool get set to the top of the window,
the 16 V engines get set at the bottom to the middle of the window.

And a cold engine at TDC

[WyattsRide]

Checked the tension this morning with the Kempf tool and the arrow was in the middle of the window at TDC. Tightened the belt slightly until the arrow was more to the tight side. Turned the engine over 2 more times and checked the tension again and it was still to the tight side of the window.

Put everything back together and took it out for a drive. 25 miles and NO Belt Ten. light!! Car is running great!

[hans14914]

Congrats!

Looking forward to seeing it out and about this year.

[worf]

Checked the tension this morning with the Kempf tool and the arrow was in the middle of the window at TDC. Tightened the belt slightly until the arrow was more to the tight side. Turned the engine over 2 more times and checked the tension again and it was still to the tight side of the window.

Put everything back together and took it out for a drive. 25 miles and NO Belt Ten. light!! Car is running great!

Awesome!